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Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
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Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » ven. aug 28, 2009 11:51 pm
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » sab. aug 29, 2009 1:20 am
THE SYLLABUS Pope Pius IX
Le Syllabus del Errores, Papa Pio IX
I. PANTHEISM, NATURALISM AND ABSOLUTE RATIONALISM
Pantheismo, naturalismo e rationalismo absolute
1. There exists no Supreme, all-wise, all-provident Divine Being, distinct from the universe, and God is identical with the nature of things, and is, therefore, subject to changes. In effect, God is produced in man and in the world, and all things are God and have the very substance of God, and God is one and the same thing with the world, and, therefore, spirit with matter, necessity with liberty, good with evil, justice with injustice. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
1. Il existe nulle Supreme, omnisciente, toto providente Esser Supreme, distincte del universo e Deo es identic con le natura de cosas, e es assi subjecto a cambiamentos. In effecto, Deo es producite in homine e in le mundo, e cata cosa es Deo e habe le substantia mesme de Deo, e Deo es le exactemente mesme cosa como le mundo, e ergo spirito con materia, necessitate con libertate, bon con mal, justitia con injustitia. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
2. All action of God upon man and the world is to be denied. —Ibid.
2. Omne action per Deo a homine e le mundo debe esser denegate. —Ibid.
3. Human reason, without any reference whatsoever to God, is the sole arbiter of truth and falsehood, and of good and evil; it is law to itself, and suffices, by its natural force, to secure the welfare of men and of nations. —Ibid.
3. Ration human, sin qualcunque referentia a Deo, es le sol arbitro de veritate e falsitate, e de bon e mal; illo es lege mesme e suffice per su fortia natural, a assecurar le assistentia de homines e nationes. —Ibid.
4. All the truths of religion proceed from the innate strength of human reason; hence reason is the ultimate standard by which man can and ought to arrive at the knowledge of all truths of every kind. —Ibid. and Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, etc.
4. Omne veritates de religion procede ab le fortia innate de ration human, de isto seque ration es le standard ultimate per le qual homine pote e deberea arrivar al cognoscentia de omne veritate de omne genre. —Ibid. e encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, etc.
5. Divine revelation is imperfect, and therefore subject to a continual and indefinite progress, corresponding with the advancement of human reason. —Ibid.
5. Le revelation divin es imperfecte, e in consequentia es subjecte a progresso continue e indefinite, correspondente con le avantiamento del ration human. —Ibid.
6. The faith of Christ is in opposition to human reason and divine revelation not only is not useful, but is even hurtful to the perfection of man. —Ibid.
6. Le fide de Christo es in opposition a ration human e revelation divin, non solmente es inutile, ma mesmo es nocue al perfection de homine. —Ibid.
7. The prophecies and miracles set forth and recorded in the Sacred Scriptures are the fiction of poets, and the mysteries of the Christian faith the result of philosophical investigations. In the books of the Old and the New Testament there are contained mythical inventions, and Jesus Christ is Himself a myth.
7. Le prophetias e miraculos comenciate e registrate in le Scripturas Sacrate es le fiction de poetas, e le mysterios del fide christian es le resultatos de investigation philosophic. In le libros del Vetere e Nove Testamento es continite inventiones mythic, e Jesus Christo es ille ipse un mytho.
gratias a laurentio e josu
Le Syllabus del Errores, Papa Pio IX
I. PANTHEISM, NATURALISM AND ABSOLUTE RATIONALISM
Pantheismo, naturalismo e rationalismo absolute
1. There exists no Supreme, all-wise, all-provident Divine Being, distinct from the universe, and God is identical with the nature of things, and is, therefore, subject to changes. In effect, God is produced in man and in the world, and all things are God and have the very substance of God, and God is one and the same thing with the world, and, therefore, spirit with matter, necessity with liberty, good with evil, justice with injustice. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
1. Il existe nulle Supreme, omnisciente, toto providente Esser Supreme, distincte del universo e Deo es identic con le natura de cosas, e es assi subjecto a cambiamentos. In effecto, Deo es producite in homine e in le mundo, e cata cosa es Deo e habe le substantia mesme de Deo, e Deo es le exactemente mesme cosa como le mundo, e ergo spirito con materia, necessitate con libertate, bon con mal, justitia con injustitia. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
2. All action of God upon man and the world is to be denied. —Ibid.
2. Omne action per Deo a homine e le mundo debe esser denegate. —Ibid.
3. Human reason, without any reference whatsoever to God, is the sole arbiter of truth and falsehood, and of good and evil; it is law to itself, and suffices, by its natural force, to secure the welfare of men and of nations. —Ibid.
3. Ration human, sin qualcunque referentia a Deo, es le sol arbitro de veritate e falsitate, e de bon e mal; illo es lege mesme e suffice per su fortia natural, a assecurar le assistentia de homines e nationes. —Ibid.
4. All the truths of religion proceed from the innate strength of human reason; hence reason is the ultimate standard by which man can and ought to arrive at the knowledge of all truths of every kind. —Ibid. and Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, etc.
4. Omne veritates de religion procede ab le fortia innate de ration human, de isto seque ration es le standard ultimate per le qual homine pote e deberea arrivar al cognoscentia de omne veritate de omne genre. —Ibid. e encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, etc.
5. Divine revelation is imperfect, and therefore subject to a continual and indefinite progress, corresponding with the advancement of human reason. —Ibid.
5. Le revelation divin es imperfecte, e in consequentia es subjecte a progresso continue e indefinite, correspondente con le avantiamento del ration human. —Ibid.
6. The faith of Christ is in opposition to human reason and divine revelation not only is not useful, but is even hurtful to the perfection of man. —Ibid.
6. Le fide de Christo es in opposition a ration human e revelation divin, non solmente es inutile, ma mesmo es nocue al perfection de homine. —Ibid.
7. The prophecies and miracles set forth and recorded in the Sacred Scriptures are the fiction of poets, and the mysteries of the Christian faith the result of philosophical investigations. In the books of the Old and the New Testament there are contained mythical inventions, and Jesus Christ is Himself a myth.
7. Le prophetias e miraculos comenciate e registrate in le Scripturas Sacrate es le fiction de poetas, e le mysterios del fide christian es le resultatos de investigation philosophic. In le libros del Vetere e Nove Testamento es continite inventiones mythic, e Jesus Christo es ille ipse un mytho.
gratias a laurentio e josu
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » dom. aug 30, 2009 12:44 am
II. MODERATE RATIONALISM
II. Rationalismo moderate
8. As human reason is placed on a level with religion itself, so theological must be treated in the same manner as philosophical sciences. —Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854.
8. Pro isto que ration human es sur nivello mesme con religion, scientias theologic debe esser tractate in le mesme maniera que le scientias philosophic. —Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854.
9. All the dogmas of the Christian religion are indiscriminately the object of natural science or philosophy, and human reason, enlightened solely in an historical way, is able, by its own natural strength and principles, to attain to the true science of even the most abstruse dogmas; provided only that such dogmas be proposed to reason itself as its object. —Letters to the Archbishop of Munich, "Gravissimas inter," Dec. 11, 1862, and "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
9. Omne dogmas del religion christian es indiscriminatemente le objecto de scientia natural o philosophia, e ration human, illuminate solmente in un maniera historic, pote, per su fortias e principios natural, attinger le scientia ver de mesmo le plus abstruse dogmas, providente solmente tal dogmas proponite a ration mesme como su objecto. —Litteras al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Gravissimas inter," Dec. 11, 1862, e "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
10. As the philosopher is one thing, and philosophy another, so it is the right and duty of the philosopher to subject himself to the authority which he shall have proved to be true; but philosophy neither can nor ought to submit to any such authority. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.
10. Como le philosopho es un cosa, e philosophia un altere, tan illo es poter e deber del philosopho a subjicer se ille ipse al autoritate que ille debe probar lo al veritate; ma philosophia nec pote nec debe submitter a alicun autoritate. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.
11. The Church not only ought never to pass judgment on philosophy, but ought to tolerate the errors of philosophy, leaving it to correct itself. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.
11. Ecclesia non solmente non debe jammais passar judicio sur philosophia; ma debe tolerar le errores de philosophia, lassante illo a corriger per illo ipse. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.
12. The decrees of the Apostolic See and of the Roman congregations impede the true progress of science. —Ibid.
12. Le decretos del sancte sede e del congregationes roman impedi le ver progresso de scientia. —Ibid.
13. The method and principles by which the old scholastic doctors cultivated theology are no longer suitable to the demands of our times and to the progress of the sciences. —Ibid.
13. Le methodo e principios per le quales vetere doctores scholastic cultivava theologia non es convenibile ja al demandas de nostre tempores e al progresso del scientias. —Ibid.
14. Philosophy is to be treated without taking any account of supernatural revelation. —Ibid.
14. Le philosophia es a esser tractate sin consideration de revelation supernatural. —Ibid.
II. Rationalismo moderate
8. As human reason is placed on a level with religion itself, so theological must be treated in the same manner as philosophical sciences. —Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854.
8. Pro isto que ration human es sur nivello mesme con religion, scientias theologic debe esser tractate in le mesme maniera que le scientias philosophic. —Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854.
9. All the dogmas of the Christian religion are indiscriminately the object of natural science or philosophy, and human reason, enlightened solely in an historical way, is able, by its own natural strength and principles, to attain to the true science of even the most abstruse dogmas; provided only that such dogmas be proposed to reason itself as its object. —Letters to the Archbishop of Munich, "Gravissimas inter," Dec. 11, 1862, and "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
9. Omne dogmas del religion christian es indiscriminatemente le objecto de scientia natural o philosophia, e ration human, illuminate solmente in un maniera historic, pote, per su fortias e principios natural, attinger le scientia ver de mesmo le plus abstruse dogmas, providente solmente tal dogmas proponite a ration mesme como su objecto. —Litteras al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Gravissimas inter," Dec. 11, 1862, e "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
10. As the philosopher is one thing, and philosophy another, so it is the right and duty of the philosopher to subject himself to the authority which he shall have proved to be true; but philosophy neither can nor ought to submit to any such authority. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.
10. Como le philosopho es un cosa, e philosophia un altere, tan illo es poter e deber del philosopho a subjicer se ille ipse al autoritate que ille debe probar lo al veritate; ma philosophia nec pote nec debe submitter a alicun autoritate. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.
11. The Church not only ought never to pass judgment on philosophy, but ought to tolerate the errors of philosophy, leaving it to correct itself. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.
11. Ecclesia non solmente non debe jammais passar judicio sur philosophia; ma debe tolerar le errores de philosophia, lassante illo a corriger per illo ipse. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.
12. The decrees of the Apostolic See and of the Roman congregations impede the true progress of science. —Ibid.
12. Le decretos del sancte sede e del congregationes roman impedi le ver progresso de scientia. —Ibid.
13. The method and principles by which the old scholastic doctors cultivated theology are no longer suitable to the demands of our times and to the progress of the sciences. —Ibid.
13. Le methodo e principios per le quales vetere doctores scholastic cultivava theologia non es convenibile ja al demandas de nostre tempores e al progresso del scientias. —Ibid.
14. Philosophy is to be treated without taking any account of supernatural revelation. —Ibid.
14. Le philosophia es a esser tractate sin consideration de revelation supernatural. —Ibid.
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » jov. sep 03, 2009 10:50 pm
III. INDIFFERENTISM, LATITUDINARIANISM
III. Indifferentismo, latitudinarianismo
15. Every man is free to embrace and profess that religion which, guided by the light of reason, he shall consider true. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862; Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
15. Omne homine es libere pro imbracial e professar iste religion le qual, conducite per le lumine del ration, ille va considerar como ver. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862; damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
16. Man may, in the observance of any religion whatever, find the way of eternal salvation, and arrive at eternal salvation. —Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846.
16. Homine pote, in le observantia de qualcunque religion, trovar le via de salvation eternal, e arrivar al salvation eterne. —Encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846.
17. Good hope at least is to be entertained of the eternal salvation of all those who are not at all in the true Church of Christ. —Encyclical "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863, etc.
17. Bon sperantia al minus es a esser amusate del salvation eternal de omnes, qui es nullemente in le ver Ecclesia de Christo. —Encyclica "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863, etc.
18. Protestantism is nothing more than another form of the same true Christian religion, in which form it is given to please God equally as in the Catholic Church. —Encyclical "Noscitis," Dec. 8, 1849.
18. Protestantismo es nihil plus que un altere forma del mesme ver religion christian, in le qual forma ille es date al placer Deo tanto equalmente como in Ecclesia catholic. —Encyclica "Noscitis," Dec. 8, 1849.
IV. SOCIALISM, COMMUNISM, SECRET SOCIETIES, BIBLICAL SOCIETIES, CLERICO-LIBERAL SOCIETIES
IV. Socialismo, communismo, cryptosocietates, societates biblic, societates clerico-liberal
Pests of this kind are frequently reprobated in the severest terms in the Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, Allocution "Quibus quantisque," April 20, 1849, Encyclical "Noscitis et nobiscum," Dec. 8, 1849, Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, Encyclical "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863.
Pestes de iste sorta es reprobate frequentemente in le terminos le plus sever in le encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, allocution "Quibus quantisque," April 20, 1849, encyclica "Noscitis et nobiscum," Dec. 8, 1849, allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, encyclica "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863.
III. Indifferentismo, latitudinarianismo
15. Every man is free to embrace and profess that religion which, guided by the light of reason, he shall consider true. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862; Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
15. Omne homine es libere pro imbracial e professar iste religion le qual, conducite per le lumine del ration, ille va considerar como ver. —Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862; damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
16. Man may, in the observance of any religion whatever, find the way of eternal salvation, and arrive at eternal salvation. —Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846.
16. Homine pote, in le observantia de qualcunque religion, trovar le via de salvation eternal, e arrivar al salvation eterne. —Encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846.
17. Good hope at least is to be entertained of the eternal salvation of all those who are not at all in the true Church of Christ. —Encyclical "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863, etc.
17. Bon sperantia al minus es a esser amusate del salvation eternal de omnes, qui es nullemente in le ver Ecclesia de Christo. —Encyclica "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863, etc.
18. Protestantism is nothing more than another form of the same true Christian religion, in which form it is given to please God equally as in the Catholic Church. —Encyclical "Noscitis," Dec. 8, 1849.
18. Protestantismo es nihil plus que un altere forma del mesme ver religion christian, in le qual forma ille es date al placer Deo tanto equalmente como in Ecclesia catholic. —Encyclica "Noscitis," Dec. 8, 1849.
IV. SOCIALISM, COMMUNISM, SECRET SOCIETIES, BIBLICAL SOCIETIES, CLERICO-LIBERAL SOCIETIES
IV. Socialismo, communismo, cryptosocietates, societates biblic, societates clerico-liberal
Pests of this kind are frequently reprobated in the severest terms in the Encyclical "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, Allocution "Quibus quantisque," April 20, 1849, Encyclical "Noscitis et nobiscum," Dec. 8, 1849, Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, Encyclical "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863.
Pestes de iste sorta es reprobate frequentemente in le terminos le plus sever in le encyclica "Qui pluribus," Nov. 9, 1846, allocution "Quibus quantisque," April 20, 1849, encyclica "Noscitis et nobiscum," Dec. 8, 1849, allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, encyclica "Quanto conficiamur," Aug. 10, 1863.
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » dom. sep 13, 2009 1:21 am
V. ERRORS CONCERNING THE CHURCH AND HER RIGHTS
V. Errores super Ecclesia e su poteres
19. The Church is not a true and perfect society, entirely free- nor is she endowed with proper and perpetual rights of her own, conferred upon her by her Divine Founder; but it appertains to the civil power to define what are the rights of the Church, and the limits within which she may exercise those rights.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.
19. Le Ecclesia es societate non ver e imperect, in toto liberte nec illa es dotate con poteres honeste e perpetue de su mesme, conferite sur ille per su Fundator Divin; ma illo appertine al potentia civil al definir lo que es le peteres del Ecclesia, e le limites intra le qual illa pote exercitar iste poteres.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.
20. The ecclesiastical power ought not to exercise its authority without the permission and assent of the civil government.—Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.
20. Le potentia ecclesiastic non debe excitar su autoritate sin le permission e assentimento del governamento civil. -Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.
21. The Church has not the power of defining dogmatically that the religion of the Catholic Church is the only true religion.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
21. Le Ecclesia non ha le potentia del definir dogmaticmente que le religion del Ecclesia catholic es le sol ver religion.-Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
22. The obligation by which Catholic teachers and authors are strictly bound is confined to those things only which are proposed to universal belief as dogmas of faith by the infallible judgment of the Church.—Letter to the Archbishop of Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
22. Le obligation perque instructores e autores catholic es strictemente bound es confirmate al ille cosas que solmente es proponite a credentia universal como dogmas de fide perque le judico infallibile del Ecclesia.-Littera al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
23. Roman pontiffs and ecumenical councils have wandered outside the limits of their powers, have usurped the rights of princes, and have even erred in defining matters of faith and morals.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
23. Pontifices roman e consilios ecumenic ha errate exterior le limites de su potentias, ha usurpate le poteres de princes, e ha mesmo errate in le definir re fide e morales.—Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
24. The Church has not the power of using force, nor has she any temporal power, direct or indirect.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
24. Le Ecclesia non ha potentia del usar fortia, nec illa ha alicun portias temporal, directe o indirecte.—Littera apostolic "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.
25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.
V. Errores super Ecclesia e su poteres
19. The Church is not a true and perfect society, entirely free- nor is she endowed with proper and perpetual rights of her own, conferred upon her by her Divine Founder; but it appertains to the civil power to define what are the rights of the Church, and the limits within which she may exercise those rights.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.
19. Le Ecclesia es societate non ver e imperect, in toto liberte nec illa es dotate con poteres honeste e perpetue de su mesme, conferite sur ille per su Fundator Divin; ma illo appertine al potentia civil al definir lo que es le peteres del Ecclesia, e le limites intra le qual illa pote exercitar iste poteres.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.
20. The ecclesiastical power ought not to exercise its authority without the permission and assent of the civil government.—Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.
20. Le potentia ecclesiastic non debe excitar su autoritate sin le permission e assentimento del governamento civil. -Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.
21. The Church has not the power of defining dogmatically that the religion of the Catholic Church is the only true religion.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
21. Le Ecclesia non ha le potentia del definir dogmaticmente que le religion del Ecclesia catholic es le sol ver religion.-Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
22. The obligation by which Catholic teachers and authors are strictly bound is confined to those things only which are proposed to universal belief as dogmas of faith by the infallible judgment of the Church.—Letter to the Archbishop of Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
22. Le obligation perque instructores e autores catholic es strictemente bound es confirmate al ille cosas que solmente es proponite a credentia universal como dogmas de fide perque le judico infallibile del Ecclesia.-Littera al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
23. Roman pontiffs and ecumenical councils have wandered outside the limits of their powers, have usurped the rights of princes, and have even erred in defining matters of faith and morals.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
23. Pontifices roman e consilios ecumenic ha errate exterior le limites de su potentias, ha usurpate le poteres de princes, e ha mesmo errate in le definir re fide e morales.—Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
24. The Church has not the power of using force, nor has she any temporal power, direct or indirect.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
24. Le Ecclesia non ha potentia del usar fortia, nec illa ha alicun portias temporal, directe o indirecte.—Littera apostolic "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.
25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per Laurentio » dom. sep 13, 2009 1:49 am
Nulle garantias de correctessa. 
Quando io ha scribite parentheses tu debe o remover solmente illos, o anque lor contento. In tote caso illos debe esser removite.
Io dicerea 'viste que' o 'proque' in loco de 'pro isto que'
que le scientias -> como...
provided -> le ceid propone 'a condition que'
alora io propone 'solmente a condition que tal dogmas es proponite...'
Alicunos usarea 'sia' in loco de 'es' - como un sorta de subjunctivo, ma io non pensa que isto es necessari.
Le anglese es un poco difficile a comprender (proposed to reason?)
Il es le mesme construction 'as... so' como in supra, ubi tu scribeva 'pro isto que' (ubi io scriberea 'proque'/viste que. alora: proque/viste que le philosopho es un cosa, e philosophia un altere, il es le derecto e obligation del philosopho (a?) submitter se al autoriate que ille ha probate (como ver?), sed (sed es plus latin/solemne que 'ma' philosophia nec pote nec deberea submitter se a ulle tal autoriate
Le ecclesia (memora le 'le') non solmente deberea nunquam judicar (le) philosophia, sed deberea tolerar le errores de(l) philosophia, lassante lo (assi que illo pote) corriger se ipse.
LE vetere doctores.... non plus es convenibile con(?) le demandas/exigentias...
Le ph. debe esser tractate sin ulle consideration...
Quando io ha scribite parentheses tu debe o remover solmente illos, o anque lor contento. In tote caso illos debe esser removite.
kamil scribeva:8. Pro isto que ration human es sur nivello mesme con religion, scientias theologic debe esser tractate in le mesme maniera que le scientias philosophic. —Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854.
Io dicerea 'viste que' o 'proque' in loco de 'pro isto que'
que le scientias -> como...
kamil scribeva:9. Omne dogmas del religion christian es indiscriminatemente le objecto de scientia natural o philosophia, e ration human, illuminate solmente in un maniera historic, pote, per su fortias e principios natural, attinger le scientia ver de mesmo le plus abstruse dogmas, providente solmente tal dogmas proponite a ration mesme como su objecto. —Litteras al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Gravissimas inter," Dec. 11, 1862, e "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
provided -> le ceid propone 'a condition que'
alora io propone 'solmente a condition que tal dogmas es proponite...'
Alicunos usarea 'sia' in loco de 'es' - como un sorta de subjunctivo, ma io non pensa que isto es necessari.
Le anglese es un poco difficile a comprender (proposed to reason?)
kamil scribeva:10. As the philosopher is one thing, and philosophy another, so it is the right and duty of the philosopher to subject himself to the authority which he shall have proved to be true; but philosophy neither can nor ought to submit to any such authority. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.10. Como le philosopho es un cosa, e philosophia un altere, tan illo es poter e deber del philosopho a subjicer se ille ipse al autoritate que ille debe probar lo al veritate; ma philosophia nec pote nec debe submitter a alicun autoritate. —Ibid., Dec. 11, 1862.
Il es le mesme construction 'as... so' como in supra, ubi tu scribeva 'pro isto que' (ubi io scriberea 'proque'/viste que. alora: proque/viste que le philosopho es un cosa, e philosophia un altere, il es le derecto e obligation del philosopho (a?) submitter se al autoriate que ille ha probate (como ver?), sed (sed es plus latin/solemne que 'ma' philosophia nec pote nec deberea submitter se a ulle tal autoriate
kamil scribeva:11. The Church not only ought never to pass judgment on philosophy, but ought to tolerate the errors of philosophy, leaving it to correct itself. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.11. Ecclesia non solmente non debe jammais passar judicio sur philosophia; ma debe tolerar le errores de philosophia, lassante illo a corriger per illo ipse. —Ibid., Dec. 21, 1863.
Le ecclesia (memora le 'le')
non solmente deberea nunquam judicar (le) philosophia, sed deberea tolerar le errores de(l) philosophia, lassante lo (assi que illo pote) corriger se ipse.kamil scribeva:
13. The method and principles by which the old scholastic doctors cultivated theology are no longer suitable to the demands of our times and to the progress of the sciences. —Ibid.13. Le methodo e principios per le quales vetere doctores scholastic cultivava theologia non es convenibile ja al demandas de nostre tempores e al progresso del scientias. —Ibid.
LE vetere doctores.... non plus es convenibile con(?) le demandas/exigentias...
kamil scribeva:14. Philosophy is to be treated without taking any account of supernatural revelation. —Ibid.14. Le philosophia es a esser tractate sin consideration de revelation supernatural. —Ibid.
Le ph. debe esser tractate sin ulle consideration...
Ask not what you can do for your conlang - ask what your conlang can do for you
- Laurentio
- cmmiur
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per Laurentio » lun. sep 28, 2009 1:49 am
kamil scribeva:19. The Church is not a true and perfect society, entirely free- nor is she endowed with proper and perpetual rights of her own, conferred upon her by her Divine Founder; but it appertains to the civil power to define what are the rights of the Church, and the limits within which she may exercise those rights.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.19.
Le Ecclesia es societate non ver e imperect, in toto liberte nec illa es dotate con poteres honeste e perpetue de su mesme, conferite sur ille per su Fundator Divin; ma illo appertine al potentia civil al definir lo que es le peteres del Ecclesia, e le limites intra le qual illa pote exercitar iste poteres.—Allocution "Singulari quadam," Dec. 9, 1854, etc.
Le Ecclesia non es un societate ver e perfecte, con libertate total - nec es illa dotate con(?) derectos proprie(? io non es secur que es intendite con 'proper' hic) e perpetue, conferite super illa per su ... ; sed il appertine al potentias civil definir lo que es le derectos del E. ... inter le quales ... derectos
Le "to define" es un poco 'tricky' - il me pare que le IG § 87 es applicabile, ergo io pensa que nulle preposition.
kamil scribeva:20. The ecclesiastical power ought not to exercise its authority without the permission and assent of the civil government.—Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.20. Le potentia ecclesiastic non debe excitar su autoritate sin le permission e assentimento del governamento civil. -Allocution "Meminit unusquisque," Sept. 30, 1861.
... deberea ... exercitar/exercer (o forsan 'applicar' o simile)
kamil scribeva:21. The Church has not the power of defining dogmatically that the religion of the Catholic Church is the only true religion.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.21. Le Ecclesia non ha le potentia del definir dogmaticmente que le religion del Ecclesia catholic es le sol ver religion.-Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
'potentia del definir' non es bon. Mi 'stomacho' dice 'potentia de definir'. Ah si, isto pare esser un IG § 89.
kamil scribeva:22. The obligation by which Catholic teachers and authors are strictly bound is confined to those things only which are proposed to universal belief as dogmas of faith by the infallible judgment of the Church.—Letter to the Archbishop of Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.22. Le obligation perque instructores e autores catholic es strictemente bound es confirmate al ille cosas que solmente es proponite a credentia universal como dogmas de fide perque le judico infallibile del Ecclesia.-Littera al archiepiscopo de Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
Le obligation per le qual .... strictemente (ob)ligate es confinate a solmente ille cosas que es proponite a ... per le judicio...
kamil scribeva:23. Roman pontiffs and ecumenical councils have wandered outside the limits of their powers, have usurped the rights of princes, and have even erred in defining matters of faith and morals.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.23. Pontifices roman e consilios ecumenic ha errate exterior le limites de su potentias, ha usurpate le poteres de princes, e ha mesmo errate in le definir re fide e morales.—Damnation "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
... ha transgressate le limites de lor potentia (io dicerea 'poter'), ha usurpate le derectos de princes, e ha mesme errate in le definition de (subjectos concernente) fide e moral.
kamil scribeva:24. The Church has not the power of using force, nor has she any temporal power, direct or indirect.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.24. Le Ecclesia non ha potentia del usar fortia, nec illa ha alicun portias temporal, directe o indirecte.—Littera apostolic "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
... de usar fortia... nec ha illa ulle fortias temporal ...
kamil scribeva:25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.25. Besides the power inherent in the episcopate, other temporal power has been attributed to it by the civil authority granted either explicitly or tacitly, which on that account is revocable by the civil authority whenever it thinks fit.—Ibid.
Hic tu ha oblidate un poco.
Ask not what you can do for your conlang - ask what your conlang can do for you
- Laurentio
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Re: Traduction de Syllabus del Errores (Syllabus Errorum)
per kamil » lun. sep 28, 2009 2:08 am
26. The Church has no innate and legitimate right of acquiring and possessing property.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Encyclical "Incredibili," Sept. 7, 1863.
26. Le Ecclesia non ha poter innate e legitimate del acquirer e posseder possession.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Encyclical "Incredibili," Sept. 7, 1863.
27. The sacred ministers of the Church and the Roman pontiff are to be absolutely excluded from every charge and dominion over temporal affairs.—Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
27. Le ministros sacre del Ecclesia e le pontificate Roman debe esser absolutemente excludite de omne carga e dominio super affaires temporal.—Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
28. It is not lawful for bishops to publish even letters Apostolic without the permission of Government.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856.
28. Illo non es legitimate pro episcopatos al publicar mesmo litteras Apostolic sin le permission de governamento.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856.
29. Favours granted by the Roman pontiff ought to be considered null, unless they have been sought for through the civil government.—Ibid.
29. Privilegios concessionari del pontificate Roman debe esser considerate nulle, usque illos habeva essite cercate pro governamento civil.—Ibid.
30. The immunity of the Church and of ecclesiastical persons derived its origin from civil law.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
30. Le immunitate del Ecclesia e le personas ecclesiastic derivate su origine ab lege civil.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
31. The ecclesiastical forum or tribunal for the temporal causes, whether civil or criminal, of clerics, ought by all means to be abolished, even without consulting and against the protest of the Holy See.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.
31. Le foro o tribunal ecclesiastic pro le causas temporal, sia civil sia criminal, de clericos, debe per omne significationes esser abolite, mesmo sin le consultar e contra le protestos del sancte sede.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.
32. The personal immunity by which clerics are exonerated from military conscription and service in the army may be abolished without violation either of natural right or equity. Its abolition is called for by civil progress, especially in a society framed on the model of a liberal government.—Letter to the Bishop of Monreale "Singularis nobisque," Sept. 29, 1864.
32. Le immunitate personal perque clericos es exonerate de conscription millitar e servicio in le armea pote esser abolite sin violation aut de poter natural aut equitate. Su abolition es nominate pro per progresso civil, in modo special in un societate inquadrate sur le modello de governamento liberal.—Letter to the Bishop of Monreale "Singularis nobisque," Sept. 29, 1864.
33. It does not appertain exclusively to the power of ecclesiastical jurisdiction by right, proper and innate, to direct the teaching of theological questions.—Letter to the Archbishop of Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
34. The teaching of those who compare the Sovereign Pontiff to a prince, free and acting in the universal Church, is a doctrine which prevailed in the Middle Ages.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
35. There is nothing to prevent the decree of a general council, or the act of all peoples, from transferring the supreme pontificate from the bishop and city of Rome to another bishop and another city.—Ibid.
36. The definition of a national council does not admit of any subsequent discussion, and the civil authority car assume this principle as the basis of its acts.—Ibid.
37. National churches, withdrawn from the authority of the Roman pontiff and altogether separated, can be established.—Allocution "Multis gravibusque," Dec. 17, 1860.
38. The Roman pontiffs have, by their too arbitrary conduct, contributed to the division of the Church into Eastern and Western.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
26. Le Ecclesia non ha poter innate e legitimate del acquirer e posseder possession.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Encyclical "Incredibili," Sept. 7, 1863.
27. The sacred ministers of the Church and the Roman pontiff are to be absolutely excluded from every charge and dominion over temporal affairs.—Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
27. Le ministros sacre del Ecclesia e le pontificate Roman debe esser absolutemente excludite de omne carga e dominio super affaires temporal.—Allocution "Maxima quidem," June 9, 1862.
28. It is not lawful for bishops to publish even letters Apostolic without the permission of Government.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856.
28. Illo non es legitimate pro episcopatos al publicar mesmo litteras Apostolic sin le permission de governamento.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856.
29. Favours granted by the Roman pontiff ought to be considered null, unless they have been sought for through the civil government.—Ibid.
29. Privilegios concessionari del pontificate Roman debe esser considerate nulle, usque illos habeva essite cercate pro governamento civil.—Ibid.
30. The immunity of the Church and of ecclesiastical persons derived its origin from civil law.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
30. Le immunitate del Ecclesia e le personas ecclesiastic derivate su origine ab lege civil.—Damnatio "Multiplices inter," June 10, 1851.
31. The ecclesiastical forum or tribunal for the temporal causes, whether civil or criminal, of clerics, ought by all means to be abolished, even without consulting and against the protest of the Holy See.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.
31. Le foro o tribunal ecclesiastic pro le causas temporal, sia civil sia criminal, de clericos, debe per omne significationes esser abolite, mesmo sin le consultar e contra le protestos del sancte sede.—Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856; Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.
32. The personal immunity by which clerics are exonerated from military conscription and service in the army may be abolished without violation either of natural right or equity. Its abolition is called for by civil progress, especially in a society framed on the model of a liberal government.—Letter to the Bishop of Monreale "Singularis nobisque," Sept. 29, 1864.
32. Le immunitate personal perque clericos es exonerate de conscription millitar e servicio in le armea pote esser abolite sin violation aut de poter natural aut equitate. Su abolition es nominate pro per progresso civil, in modo special in un societate inquadrate sur le modello de governamento liberal.—Letter to the Bishop of Monreale "Singularis nobisque," Sept. 29, 1864.
33. It does not appertain exclusively to the power of ecclesiastical jurisdiction by right, proper and innate, to direct the teaching of theological questions.—Letter to the Archbishop of Munich, "Tuas libenter," Dec. 21, 1863.
34. The teaching of those who compare the Sovereign Pontiff to a prince, free and acting in the universal Church, is a doctrine which prevailed in the Middle Ages.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
35. There is nothing to prevent the decree of a general council, or the act of all peoples, from transferring the supreme pontificate from the bishop and city of Rome to another bishop and another city.—Ibid.
36. The definition of a national council does not admit of any subsequent discussion, and the civil authority car assume this principle as the basis of its acts.—Ibid.
37. National churches, withdrawn from the authority of the Roman pontiff and altogether separated, can be established.—Allocution "Multis gravibusque," Dec. 17, 1860.
38. The Roman pontiffs have, by their too arbitrary conduct, contributed to the division of the Church into Eastern and Western.—Apostolic Letter "Ad Apostolicae," Aug. 22, 1851.
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